Journal To Dreams Founder Pariss Sailsman - we talk parenting & Black Women in Business

Introduction to Pariss

I am so excited to have had the privilege of interviewing the founder of Journal To Dreams, Pariss Sailsman. Pariss launched Journal To Dreams in January 2021. She is a specialist practitioner, and she works with women, children and families. She's also a writer and her ebook ‘Mindset Glowing’ is just incredible.

Pariss is all about empowerment, uplifting others, and her mantra is, ‘We're all gonna make it to the top.’ I think that is so incredible.

Here is the first part of my interview with Pariss, where we talk about her story, what it takes to be a successful Black Woman in Business, and how we need to go back to basics in life.

You will see Pariss’ responses in black, and my questions and reflections in orange.

Pariss tell me a bit about your business Journal To Dreams and what you do…

I wear a number of different hats, I'm a specialist practitioner. But I'm a writer, and I work with women, children and families with the main aim of guiding women, children and families back home to themselves.

And what I mean by that is, quite often we align with society's values and what we should be, who we should be, and the milestones that we should be achieving in life.

So for me, the aim is to get back to basics. What do you love, what brings you peace, and I'm really encouraging children and young people to do that. Specifically children, because I feel like it's a lot harder for them to know what their innate value is, what they bring to the world and what makes them feel happy rather than grades and education and school.

I've done a lot of workshops where children have said, ‘I am bound by my grades, and that's not necessarily what I'm good at’. So I've really been working with children and young people, because I just feel like they're our future.

Like you’ve said my mantra, ‘we're all gonna make it to the top.’ It's not about competition. There's room and space for us all to thrive. And it's about building a community where we can do that together. Because it gets lonely. The journey gets lonely.

Pariss’s Business Journey…

And your business is so interesting, because you started out focusing more on women, and it's evolved into helping children. But that is such an amazing place to start, isn't it? Because we have to start from the ground up?

Prior to starting the business, I was a multisystemic therapist, which was working with children and families. And prior to that I worked for the youth justice service for five years. So my heart was in children and young people anyway, it's embedded in my blood.

And so I thought, let me try something different and start working with women. But for some reason, young people have aligned back through my journey and I absolutely love it. I really love having the variation of being able to help different parts of the community. It's a true blessing.

If there's people reading this that have got children, how would you advise them? What would you say to them? How could they help guide their children in the right way, without having all that pressure around grades and schooling,

It's so, so difficult, one of the things that children always say to me is ‘I don't feel listened to’. Often it's the case that children feel like they shouldn't be heard, children should just listen.

However, when you actually listen to a child's voice and what they're actually saying it adds so much value and learning for us. And I know that when I was growing up, it was like children shouldn't be heard, you should just listen. Do as I say, not as I do.

I’m really trying to break down that generational curse, so to speak, because there's so much value in what a young person says. And when I have young people in sessions they often say, ‘I just want to be listened to’.

I always say your children should have protected time, this is half an hour or even 15 minutes after school to say, ‘How was you day? What did you enjoy? What can I help you with?’. You know, we're all busy, I've got a business, two children and a partner, so I know how hard it is to create that time.

But you have to be intentional because I think that's where children will stray to peers and friends where they feel part of something and feel listened to.

If you can create that, that kind of bubble, that safe bubble at home, it's half the job. Because I always say that children should feel safe to express their emotions with people that they love. And it's really just a simple thing, it's just listening intently.

Pariss’s View On Under Representation of Women and Black Women In Business

One of the topics that I'm really passionate about addressing is the under representation of women, but also the under representation of black women in business. And that's something that I really want to change in the future. I know that you're really passionate about it as well. So what do you think it takes to be a successful woman in business, but also a successful black woman in business?

I love that you brought that subject to the table. I really do think it's something that people shy away from. And it's something that I've experienced in my journey.

I’ll start with black women, I think as black women, we often get in our own way. Speaking to black business owners, imposter syndrome is rife amongst black business owners, because we know from statistics, that we're not put at the forefront for opportunities. So I think really getting out of our own way, is the first thing that we have to work on. This is about believing that we deserve to be sat around that table, kick down those doors, sit around that table and tell your story.

And we might come across as more passionate, which sometimes is listed as aggressive, but it’s important to always be authentically yourself. Because that is who we are and that's what we bring to the table. So I think, let's not try and conform, and don't settle, because that's the beauty of who we are as black women.

And I think it's very true for all women as well. Let's not dull ourselves down when we're in a table or in a space full of men. Speak up about what you bring to the table, your innate value, and let's not shy away from who we are and what we can achieve.

Also, speak openly and widely about the legacy that you want to create. I think that's a huge thing as well, because I have got a lot to prove not just to the world, but to myself. As a black woman I want to show all the little black girls that we can achieve anything.

I started with a vision but I didn't know where I wanted to go with it. But look what happens when you lead with your heart and you believe in yourself. And you know that when people say ‘mindset is everything’. It really is, it honestly is.

I think we all have those visions, whether it's in our dreams, or whether it's, when we're out on a on a walk in nature somewhere. And for me, it's about girls and females, not ignoring their vision, but writing it down and taking a little bit of action towards achieving it each day.

For example, you could do loads of journaling in your notepad, whether it's coming up with names for a brand, or whether it's drawing out your website for a social movement or a new business, or whatever it may be.

The legacy part is so important, because I believe that black women have such incredible stories that they can share with the world to help people understand what it's like and how we can encourage them to thrive.

One of the main misconceptions when I speak to black women is that we were taught generationally, we have to be strong, we have to be independent, we don't cry, we just get things done.

I was really empowered when I learnt I didn’t have to be strong all the time, let's let go of that narrative now. Because it's outdated. There's times when I cry, I'm gonna feel weak. There's times when I need my loved ones to lift me up. I feel we aren’t doing that enough anymore.

When I speak to my black female clients, and the black young children that I work with, and just say, you don't have to be strong, like, where's this come from? Why are you different? You're not allowed to cry? Yeah, you're allowed to cry. I think that one big thing is the narrative that we have to be strong.

And it's even in childbirth! Even in every area of our life. There's this misconception, that we need to be strong. We don't need pain relief. There's just so much that I've seen, even when I had my little ones, I was saying ‘I'm in a lot of pain’. And we get told ’Oh, well, you don't look like you're in pain’. And I’m like, ‘I'm telling you, I'm in pain’. So even that that's a typical example.

There's so many stereotypes of what a black woman should be. And I'd love to see when black women, and women in general, are leading so many amazing female businesses out there. And it warms my heart to think, wow, you're really creating change.

And I think a practical thing that you can do is look and try to support those women in business. So try to purposely go for those underrepresented groups in society when you're looking for services in your business. And I think men have got a massive role to play in that as well, because there's so many men in business and in corporate jobs, making big decisions, they need to be making purposeful efforts to bring in women, black women, all different cultures, because they're often the ones that are in power, making the decisions.

Absolutely. It's like a multi-faceted approach to this challenge and it's really nice, because I've actually met males on my journey, white males that have been so, so appreciative of my journey, and what I bring as a black woman. Even to the point where Head of Services have said, as a black female, I think you'd be an amazing role model for some of the young people that we work with.

So it is being recognised and it's so nice when it's people outside of the black community that are doing that. And I think that's great that you're asking me.

I really want to know where your motivation has come from to support the black community, because that has to be really intentional. And there has to be a why behind it.

The Black Lives Matter movement was massive for me. And I, at the time, had a business in the care sector. I spoke to our carers that were from a different ethnic background to me. And I asked them, what is their point of view? How has it affected them? And what could I do to help? And some of those responses really, really inspired me and made me really strongly want to be part of the change.

I was scared to put myself out there, I've just recently finished reading Glennon Doyle's book called ‘Untamed’ which is incredible. She does some incredible stuff in this area. And she actually got criticised because she's a white woman, and she was trying to help the black community, she got criticised and called a racist. So I'm almost nervous about the topic to some extent, but I'm not nervous enough to stop me wanting to do something about it.

I've also always had friends and boyfriends from different cultures. And I am attracted to connecting with people that are from different walks of life to me, because that's where I learn. And I think life is really boring if we surround ourselves with people that are all the same as us!

That's absolutely incredible. I'm really good at judging peoples character, and I'm very intuitive. And we've had a few conversations away from here, haven't we, about race and about black women in business? And I always see how intently you listen, and we have discussions, and you've got a real interest.

I just think it's lovely, as sometimes I've found other people, when they hear black women talking about certain issues, it's almost dismissed. Because as a black woman, you're talking about black issues, but when it comes from other people from other backgrounds it forms a collective and has more impact. It almost feels more that we're creating that change, because it's different voices of reason.

The other thing for me was my brother, Dean, was passionate about it as well, when Black Lives Matter happened. He read up quite a lot about it. And that was the first time that I really understood white privilege. I understood how underrepresented, not only black people were, but particularly black women. And then I was like, ‘Oh, my goodness, just being born as a white female, I was naturally going to have more opportunities than a black female’, which I just think is, mental.

I've always been very passionate about the gender pay gap, and a strong advocate for promoting women in business in general.

And I have a daughter. So another reason is that I'm so passionate about her, surrounding herself by different cultures. And yeah, that is something that I want to make sure happens throughout her life. We live in Essex, but actually, she has got friends from all different cultures. And I love that. And I encourage it, and I think it's so, so important.

That's absolutely incredible. It's amazing, because I can really see it comes from a genuine place. And I think a lot of people get upset when they see, for instance, black owned initiatives, or black women in business forums and groups. But because we have to work a lot harder to get there, we recognise it, and we praise it. And I suppose that's the time where as a white person, you don't necessarily see the privilege that you have. So it’s hard to understand the reason for having to have those black owned initiatives, and the black only forums to celebrate that, because it's not been as easy, the journey hasn't been as easy. The amount of trials and tribulations and setbacks that we've had to endure is more than if we were white.

I continue to try and bring it into my business in ways that I can. And I know we've talked about perhaps doing something with young females from different cultures in the future. Recently I came across this young entrepreneurs awards for children in their early teenage years. And when I looked at the top 5, there was no black women, at all, and there was only one female - the rest were all males. There was only one black male too. I just really hope that we can change that.

And that's why, you know, on my journey we're all gonna make it to the top because I'm bringing everybody with me. Everyone's going along with me, we're a community. And we've all been through this journey together.

We Can All Make It To The Top

‘We can all make it to the top’. Tell me more about that. Like how do you think we can help each other? What are the practical things we can do to actually make that happen? Because saying it is one thing, but what what's the actual tangible stuff we can do?

One of my core values is collaboration and networking. And I think it's important because as business owners, we know it's really, really lonely. We know that we can't meet our goals by ourselves. So one of the things that I've been doing in the last year or so is building networks with people that do similar things to me, and we all have the same goals, but we're achieving them in completely different ways. So for instance what I love about the women that I've come across is that they don't feel like it's a competition, we all want the same outcome for the people that we serve. So we're just working together to do it.

An example of that was the well being workshops called ‘Essence Youth Mentoring’ (you can find them on Instagram here), they work specifically with girls. They invited me to support one of their workshops. They bought my expertise in to add value to those girls, ultimately. And that's what I mean about all of us, going to the top, coming together for a common goal, but delivering it in different ways.

Another way is bringing women together. So it's like what you do with The Village, you do amazing stuff, you do an amazing job of bringing women together in business that might have the same issues or problems that they want to solve. That in itself is helping each other to the top. Because you help each other to solve those issues that they may have.

Just because you give someone else value doesn't mean you've taken it out of your pocket. So I might give you a piece of value today. And you might deliver that to somebody else that helps them and another 100 people, but that hasn't taken out of my pocket, because I probably never would have met those people anyway. And you're going to deliver in a completely different way to what I would.

That's where that value comes from as female business owners, because we want to build those networks, and we want to nurture each other.

Pariss thank you so much for taking the time to speak with me, how can people get in touch with you if they would like to?

My website is journaltodreams.com My Instagram is @journaltodreams, Facebook Journaltodreams.

And I just want to do one last plug for your ebook mindset glowing, because that is incredibly inspiring if you want a little piece of Pariss in your life, and that is the best way right now - buy it here

Thank you so much for coming and speaking on the Jen Lister Podcast! I'm genuinely so grateful.

It's been amazing. And as always, thank you for having me. Like I'm so blessed to have you on my journey. So thank you for everything.